GROSS: Well, I want to take a short break here. It was there I found, beside the Alamo, enchantment, strange as the blue up above. It could be something you played. GROSS: Amanda Shires, its been such a pleasure to talk with you. Im not a big AA guy, but Ill go every once in a while. And youve called on country music stars to speak out, too. SHIRES: Oh, I would have had to find somebody to drive me to Mexico or somewhere else. Upcoming Dates Past Im your Amanda. You had an abortion. Tommy Duncan was the singer. Just admit Im what you want. (In "Wasn't I Paying Attention," a tale of dramatically staged, small-town suicide, for example, the way she sings the word "attention" amplifies the narrator's unsettled state.) You dont see a lot of men speaking up, and every voice is helpful. One is a Honduran asylum-seeker who died while trying to cross the border. Bridget Bentz, Molly Seavy-Nesper and Kitty Eisele adapted it for the web. And she was also holding down a day job as a single mom. "I did a parking lot pirouette / I said, 'You're right I'm not done with you yet.'" GROSS: So that was the Highwomen, which is a song performed by the supergroup The Highwomen, which was co-founded by my guest, Amanda Shires, and Brandi Carlile. I got up to sing, and I was like, oh, crap. And I said, Id love to. So I was left to the radio choices of sports ball and country top 40 country music. So I couldnt really get into it. And it was a Carrie Underwood song from it was, like, six years before that or something. Why didnt more people show up and speak up? No way. No more? But through the process of making the record and all the things that go with that, the hours and the tedium, it got easier for us to have conversations, not because we were doing the work of addressing the problems, but because we found common ground on something again, which has always been music and words.. So one of the things you learned, like, I think in the past few years is that your grandfather had spent years in prison. And this is basically, like, a country supergroup. It de-stigmatizes the conversation. In 2020, she penned an op-ed for Rolling Stone about why abortion rights matter. Teaching himself to hear his own songs objectively has been one of the harder lessons to learn, he says: Its impossible to get that distance for me. And it just worked when we did it. And I was still dealing with all of it two and a half weeks later. I know they enjoy it. GROSS: Well, in 2020, you and your husband, Jason Isbell, recorded a duet of a song you wrote called The Problem. And the song is from the perspective of a teenage couple. SHIRES: My whole left arm is tattoos of Leonard Cohen. Isbell said he had to cancel his Asheville shows scheduled for Jan. 11-12, but he and his team are working to reschedule shows in Louisville, Columbus, Wilkes-Barre and Wilmington. And I got awarded a scholarship to be able to go to those. Like, do you say, hey, honey, heres a song I wrote about how bad things are between us right now? GROSS: That sounds really, really awful. Shes also one of the founders of the group The Highwomen. Then I get to the end of the recording process and try to decide what makes the best collection of songs. I could just trust based on how Leonard Cohen did all that work for us. And her latest album is called Take It Like A Man. Well be right back after a short break. GROSS: You know, youve said that a lot of the songs on this album come from a troubled period of your marriage to songwriter and singer Jason Isbell, who you perform with and who plays on this album. A moonlit pass that only she would know still hears my broken song of love. SHIRES: I mean OK Im going to call her up after this, too. There were probably 2,500 people, and Im just standing there with a guitar, elevated and facing everyone. Because once you have a baby, theres no social programming to help. Shires plays fiddle in her husband Jason Isbells band, Jason Isbell and the 400 Unit. But I am living still. You know, its Jimmy Webbs song originally, but. And after we recorded it, he said, Thats a really good song. And I said, Thats all you have to say. And Lanny Fiel, he would say, youre really, really great at the parts you love. Singer, songwriter and fiddle player Amanda Shires still remembers the moment she fell in love with the fiddle. And for a lot of folks, that can be the most boring part of the three-part string ensemble thing. SHIRES: Yep, yep on his songs without asking him. The election is November 8. You can just say Im crazy. I am your man. And because I was in the time of my life where I was having a disconnect in my marriage and not feeling great in with music but I discovered that it takes a lot to be vulnerable, and it takes a lot to talk to folks and to understand each other. 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The bastards hung me at the Salem gallows hill. A woman threw a house party with 65 men she matched with on Tinder and Hinge and connected with the man she's been dating for a year. If you see my milk cow, please drive her on home cause I had no milk and butter no since my cows been gone. And couple of lessons like that, he pulled out some fiddle tunes that he had been transcribing aurally from Frankie McWhorter. So thanks to them as well. SHIRES: I found that out for Christmas, Jasons merchandise guy, Chance, gave us each our family trees. Well definitely get to your verse, which is the second one. And as it happened, eventually the auxiliary cable quit working in the van so I was left to the radio choices of sports ball and Top 40 country music. She performs in several settings and has received awards in each of them. So I started just taking notes on the radio because I heard it. And it was a picture of hands holding on to nothing. Lets get back to my interview with Amanda Shires, a great singer and songwriter who also co-founded the band The Highwomen, which is a kind of all-star country music band. I was like, Thats what I want to do, because you play this song and then you get to improvise you just play what you feel within the chord. Shires character wrestles with the decision and the right thing to do in her situation, while Isbells character offers his support for whatever decision she makes. If youre just joining us, my guest is songwriter, singer, musician Amanda Shires. It rings out like its supposed to. Amanda Shires is a singing, songwriting. A lark in the shower from the night to the morning after. I dont understand why its such a big issue, as big of an issue as it is. Not standing up for folks is not helping and its not right. And tell us how. And hes saying, you know, basically that hes going to support her and hes there for her. And I really liked it. When she paints a picture of motherhood in the subdued jangle-pop number "Charms," she doesn't dwell on its oft-idealized and sentimentalized facets. She makes the decision before it gets to the point where she makes a mistake, and I like that. So I dont have to go trying to learn all these other things. And I dont know how I feel about that. And if you want a doctor, Ill examine every inch of you. Recently, I had an ectopic pregnancy, she tweeted. I would have died had this procedure not been available to me. In my case, I blame the education system, but I didnt even know what an ectopic pregnancy was. She has a big conscience, a big heart. The 100 Greatest TV Shows of All Time And she was doing the bail bonding on the night. I dont feel like it matches whats going on inside my brain. Its as opposed to being in the uterus, where it belongs. GROSS: And me of you, so thank you. GROSS: I think its time for another break. SHIRES: Oh, yeah. And I was trying to sing that song A Little Walk With You (ph). I never wouldve thought that before, but now I know its true. Wade was leaked last month, Amanda Shires shared some personal news on social media. Then I told my friend Dave Cobb about my idea and he really liked it, and he said, Im going to have you meet Brandi Carlile. GROSS: Oh, thats great. I said, itd be cool if I was The Highwomen or maybe had a band The Highwomen. 'Mandalorian' star Pedro Pascal, creators on new Grogu revelations and 'Last of Us' comparisons, Saved by the bell: Contestant ordered to keep mask on, in historic 'Masked Singer' first, Chris Pine admits 'it does look' like Harry Styles spit on him but this is what actually happened, Rebel Wilson 'collapsed' after Ramona Agruma proposal: 'I was so overwhelmed', Amy Grant recalls being 'so scared' to return to touring following serious bike accident. Here's why. The Idol: How HBOs Next Euphoria Became Twisted Torture Porn And thats when the fertilized egg stays in the fallopian tube. We have to work hard now to mobilize and help people vote. Thats the song Faultlines, performed by Amanda Shires with Zach Setchfield on guitar in Amandas home studio outside of Nashville, Tenn. Thats one of the songs on her new album, Take It Like a Man. So lets talk about that song a little bit. When it reopened, he was in the first 200. Weve had legal abortions for 50 years and now, suddenly, a long-held right will be illegal. Im so glad you wrote it. Snubbing the King: Why Don't Big Stars Want to Perform at Charles' Coronation? Web0:00 / 2:57 Amanda Shires - Fault Lines (Official Audio) Amanda Shires 26.8K subscribers Subscribe 23K views 6 months ago "Fault Lines" is on Amanda Shires' new album. Our guest will be Mark Bergen, author of the new book Like, Comment, Subscribe in which he reports on how YouTube ushered in a world of abundant content and creativity of influencers and online hustlers, of information overload and endless culture wars. And I was reading mine. So to give listeners a sense of Bob Wills & The Texas Playboys, listeners who dont know who they are, this is a classic 1940 recording of New San Antonio Rose., (SOUNDBITE OF SONG, NEW SAN ANTONIO ROSE), BOB WILLS AND HIS TEXAS PLAYBOYS: (Singing) Deep within my heart lies a melody, a song of old San Antone (ph) San Antone where in dreams I live with a memory beneath the stars, all alone. And the fallopian tube just cant it it cant expand enough to accommodate a growing fetus. But I think she probably knew. GROSS: Without him asking? And how did you figure out what you wanted your point of view to be, you know, like, who the song would be about? I mean, many songwriters would say, oh, theyre not about me. We have Olivia Rodrigo and Phoebe Bridgers speaking up, and Ariana Grande. So I would be studying my pieces. And thank you so much for having me as a guest. GROSS: Lawrence Rothman produced your new album. I hope that if Roe v. Wade is overturned, it causes such a fucking uproar that we end up with more rights than we had before. Im glad to be a listener and also glad to see folks from those generations supporting the right to choose. I said, I just wrote this song. Michael Schmelling. It doesnt have to be Im Your Man. I just know that youve done that. And in this case, I wanted Jason to also come in and sing it, too. And then I thought about Waylon and Kris and them of The Highwaymen, and I was like, they were kind of speaking about ageism. Shes not really a rock & roll kid, for lack of a better term. In 2020, The Highwomen won Album of the Year at the Americana Music Honors and Awards ceremony. Our interviews and reviews are produced and edited by Amy Salit, Phyllis Myers, Sam Briger, Lauren Krenzel, Heidi Saman, Therese Madden, Ann Marie Baldonado, Thea Chaloner, Seth Kelley and Susan Nyakundi. I am Terry Gross. In the first half of the 20th century citizens from every walk of life gathered at the Ryman to enjoy the greatest preachers, entertainers, speakers and politicians of the day. AMANDA SHIRES AND JASON ISBELL: (Singing) Everythings going to be OK. Its going to be all right. Recognition has been building steadily; he won Song of the Year at the 2012 Americana Honors and Awards at the Ryman Auditorium last September for Alabama Pines. He calls his superb backing band the 400 Unit, after the psychiatric ward of a hospital near Muscle Shoals, the part of the state where he grew up. And there was a guy that also played the guitar, like a multi-instrumentalist side person. Amanda Shires and Jason Isbell depict a couple having an honest, difficult conversation about abortion in the new song The Problem.. Since publishing my op-ed, Ive heard from some folks who are in their eighties. She sings of the excruciating awareness of both mirroring and superseding her own mother. SHIRES: (Singing) Im well aware of what the nights made of. And so I felt in my mind, I felt those things. I know everyone is scared of losing their rung on the ladder, but there are more important things, I think, than your fame. And nobody would let me in, but I sat there anyway. And I had been internally bleeding for a whole lot of hours. If you purchase a product or register for an account through one of the links on our site, we may receive compensation. My daughter was about a year old, and I was getting into my touring van because I hadnt worked my way into a bus yet. 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